New software update for S9P-S9B-S9-S5P-S5 and S3 devices 2.20.28

Brad_Olwin

@cosme-costa I have a lab test for VO2 Max at 56, and a lot of data with both a Suunto 9Peak as well as now a Garmin Epix 2. With the Suunto my values typically bounce between 45 and 50. I am now doing a fair bit of vertical that is technical so downhill speeds are not fast, I see my VO2 dropping when I do these runs. I am in a Tempo block now for training (almost done) where I am not running much over LTR and that has dropped my VO2Max as well. The highest values I get are interval speed work on flat terrain as intervals on hills do not provide as high a VO2Max value.
The Garmin seems a little less sensitive as I am typically 46-50 for VO2Max but I am losing there too as soon as I stopped doing intervals. I have a major anaerobic deficit. (One of the many things I dislike about the Garmin as there is no recourse. It seems geared completely to road running).

So, I would not worry too much about your values, I have not seen dramatic changes but am seeing mine drop as I expected even though I am more fit and getting faster on my routes. You are a strong runner so I would not be overly concerned about the data, the watches are only so good.

cosme.costa

@dimitrios-kanellopoulos you know what I do…. Yes I did a hike in between, Sunday, but I haven’t written it down because the values were the same than on Saturday, no change, 55.5. Do you think that it could have such impact?

@Brad_Olwin, eventually it is not so important and I know that can fluctuate (in a race the only important value is the total time, non all the other metrics are important). The thing is that with the previous algo, the VO2max in trail running used to go down a little bit less than now, and I always thought that was because it didn’t consider well the ascent, so I expected that the new algo would be more close to running in flat because it takes into account the ascent but it seems that is more sensible.

Anyway, thank you all!!

freeheeler

@dmytro
no, just the verity sense and the polar beat app… don’t know how accurate it really is… but then I don’t know it with S9 either, right?!
next time I have an appointment with my pneumologist, I’ll ask if VO2max was one value of the test I did couple of years ago with the mask and the spinning bike…

freeheeler

@dmytro
did the test this morning with Polar: 35
maybe I wasn’t relaxed enough after the alarm clock woke me up

DMytro

@freeheeler I see, so basically both polar and firstbeat aren’t to be trusted XD.

MiniForklift

My VO2 Max never changes on my S9B, no matter what where I’m at with my training it’s always been 53.9

freeheeler

@dmytro
I think so, as it’s only estimation.

that’s suspicious, too

isazi

Maybe we should move this to the VO2max topic…
Anyway the new firmware works great for me. I tried hiking with hills and some uphill running, and the value did not drop. It used to drop dramatically in the past (being that HR was much more elevated for the same pace going uphill), now it does not.

Likarnik

@isazi I noticed the same

cosme.costa

Yesterday I did a run (no trail running), 9 km flat out, not much more in me, I wanted to run 10 km but my running partner got injured at km 9. My pace was 4:04 min/km, and avg HR 163 bpm (47% Z5, 40% Z4 and 11% Z3) and my VO2max went from 54.3 to 55.2, so 0.9 up.

This was more or less what I expected, and I’m pretty sure that If I run some km mainly in my Z4 it will go up again. But then I have my doubts with trail running, will test more.

Dimitrios Kanellopoulos

@cosme-costa keep in mind that the Algo afaik tries to find a best effort with good hr readings and flat ground. That’s it’s preference I think. I think as the FB Algo is a black box.

Could it be that you can do VO2max only once per day?
Today I started trail running.
At start after a few meters I forgot something.
Then I quickly stopped, canceled and not saved the activity.
There was a V02max on summary in watch.
Then I started the second time for real.
At the end no VO2max.

ChrisA

@freeheeler Polars „lay down“ VO2max test yields strange results for me (between 30 and 42). But their running index is quite similar (40) to what I get from Suunto 9P (40.5) or Garmin (41)

freeheeler

@chrisa
VO2max is a blackbox for me… I recently had better values when going slower than when I did faster sessions…

suzzlo

@freeheeler it’s not about pace, it’s about how HR is affected by intensity…

I mean, Firstbeat VO2Max algo, uses speed vs HR: “The Firstbeat algorithm analyzes the relationship between HR and exercise speed at multiple points during a training session” link so if the algo, “thinks” that at low speed you are proportionally consuming less oxygen that at high speed, it will give you a better figure…

BR

@freeheeler For me VO2max is very reliable and plausible on Suuntos. The ratio HR and pace is crucial, not only fast running. For example I did a lot improvement to my running technique. I do not run always faster, but with a way lower HR (same speed). My VO2max improved much. But I think VO2max should in general give a feeling of max power. But algo can also be interpreted, how efficient running is. That’s how I use it. Of course there are better days in my running form and normal days. Maybe there is also a litte smoothening over last trainings (but this I do not know).

MiniForklift

@freeheeler said in New software update for S9P-S9B-S9-S5P-S5 and S3 devices 2.20.28:

@chrisa
VO2max is a blackbox for me… I recently had better values when going slower than when I did faster sessions…

Mine has never changed, it’s permanently stuck on 53.9. Would be great if it worked as it’s a value I’d likely to find quite useful

freeheeler

@suzzlo
hence I am more efficient at lower speeds…

suzzlo

@freeheeler I think you (and me, and everyone) should be efficient at the speed you are used to train.

Also, I think this algo is designed to give value to us (amateur athletes) and not to be a lab test substitute…
I mean, it works in also in not high demanding sports like walking.

BR

Dimitrios Kanellopoulos

keep in mind vo2max can drop and rise for many conditions especially a health related issue such as inflamation