S+ Ghost Runner
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Sadly no description of the lowest field. Already searched for it there. Sometimes there was something like 61km and a symbol at do not remember. I don‘t understand what it means…
Yes, S9B
Today I loaded a track (30km 2000m+) and set pace at 10min30sek / km. Now I know that red middle field means I am in front of the ghost. I thought red is „bad“ and I am behind which could not be at that point…
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@_marcus_ from the manual page you shared:
Adjusts a target distance in km or miles or a target duration for the run. This enables the finish time/distance estimate calculation during the run. Target is set in the sport mode options. The finish estimation is shown on the bottom row on the display during the run.
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Well, I set up a track as said 30km 2000m+, I started Ghost Runner and entered 10m30s as Target Pace. And the lower field sometimes showed 61km which I can’t interpret. During the run I did not understand that field.
But when I can’t switch the middle field from distance to time it barely helps me for the upcoming Lavaredo Ultra Trail. I prefer time over distance to estimate my run behavior and as a suggestion: For me “red” indicates more the worse state, that I am behind the Ghost and “green” the better state, that I am in front of the Ghost.
Don’t know what the other think about it…
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@_marcus_ said in S+ Ghost Runner:
Well, I set up a track as said 30km 2000m+, I started Ghost Runner and entered 10m30s as Target Pace. And the lower field sometimes showed 61km which I can’t interpret. During the run I did not understand that field.
Where did you enter target pace? It is computed automatically with the average pace of your first kilometer, or with the last lap. The lower 61k meant the estimated distance at your pace is 61k, not sure where it did get the time though. Sure you didn’t enter 10 hours and a half as target time?
But when I can’t switch the middle field from distance to time it barely helps me for the upcoming Lavaredo Ultra Trail. I prefer time over distance to estimate my run behavior and as a suggestion: For me “red” indicates more the worse state, that I am behind the Ghost and “green” the better state, that I am in front of the Ghost.
It has been debated, but this is a design decision. It is considered being equally bad being faster or slower than a target, because the point is being on target, not faster.
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@_marcus_ The idea behind the + app is to maintain the Ghost Runner Pace, for example if pacing a race you do not want to be far ahead as you may crash and burn. So, if you are too far ahead or behind you will see a red field with either a “+” our “-” to indicate ahead or behind. Unfortunately you cannot change the center field to time. You can set target pace at any time by pressing the lap button.
And regarding the bottom field. If you set a target duration or distance the bottom field will show the distance you will finish based on the pace you are running.
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@_marcus_ also the Lavaredo ultra trail has a finite and known distance. Enter that as target, and the lower field will estimate the time to finish based on pace.
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Now that is a good point…I will check, but that could be the mistake that I entered 10h30min at „target option“
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@_marcus_ that would explain your 61k estimated finish distance for 10:30 hours at your pace.
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Ok thank you. Maybe design is not intuitive for how I thought it works but now I know and will try it out.
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@_marcus_ we all hope this S+ will improve further, because it can become a pretty nice racing tool.
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Actually I like the idea behind that Garmin PacePro and maybe I will use that for the LUT as I am more familiar with it. But as you said, maybe Ghost Runner will improve over time…
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Just for clarification, maybe I use the S9P parallel for testing during LUT:
- Snap-to-route and load track
- activate Ghost Runner
- Target: Distance: 77km (as the loaded track says)
- how to enter my planned time of 13h? The first kilometer is flat but afterwards first ascent is round about 1000m+. So the initial pace, when I understand right, is set by the first km but will not match the entire route. Any ideas on how to set it up or do you think Ghost Runner is not made for Ultratrails right now?
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@_marcus_ yeah, you will not run same pace all the time.
For your use case you would need a “profiled ghost runner”, which is difficult to plan and program ahead of the race.
Still you can set the ghost speed anytime with two button presses (min 10s apart).
So you can set your ghost speed in flat and choose a second ghost speed in the ascent. -
@_marcus_ Why not use the S+ Training peaks pace running, there you have the NGP which is a better as a target rather than a constant pace. In the mountains you won’t be able to use a constant pace but you can use a normalized grade pace.
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@bulkan hm, you are right, but I did not use it up to now so I have no idea how “good” the NGP calculation would match my pace. Maybe I test it for the next Ultra in August.
I think NGP is a round about 6min/km for the LUT, but don’t know exactly
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@_marcus_ said in S+ Ghost Runner:
Just for clarification, maybe I use the S9P parallel for testing during LUT:
- Snap-to-route and load track
- activate Ghost Runner
- Target: Distance: 77km (as the loaded track says)
- how to enter my planned time of 13h? The first kilometer is flat but afterwards first ascent is round about 1000m+. So the initial pace, when I understand right, is set by the first km but will not match the entire route. Any ideas on how to set it up or do you think Ghost Runner is not made for Ultratrails right now?
Set the target duration at 13h and don’t worry about the ghost runner pace, the bottom field will show the distance you have traveled and the expected distance at your pace. When you are too slow the expected distance will be less than 77km and when faster over 77km.
Alternatively you could set the distance as a target in the watch and ghost runner will show the estimated time in the bottom row. This is how I used it for my race.
You can set a target pace at any time by pressing the lap button twice with at least 10s between presses.
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@brad_olwin
Thank you very much! -
@_marcus_ A small correction, I believe if you set distance as the target then the bottom row will show time to finish distance. I will check this on my run tomorrow to be sure.
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@brad_olwin No, you were right, the last row show distance alternate with estimated total duration ( even if is only hh:mm and the calculation algorithm seems too much based on instantaneous speed than on average speed)
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@lorenzo12375 Not only that, but it shows ETA as if you have to run the whole distance with the current pace, not the remaining distance. At least, that what it looked like when I tested it.
