Incompetent graphs

Dimitrios Kanellopoulos

@Droro All Suunto personel are super sportive Ultra runners etc etc etc.

you want to see some from the management as well?

Here you go https://vimeo.com/317009228?fbclid=IwAR3PpYOtjqMCyF4umklwCZNK32rZAgZ-9kO0QIYeVcLzsN76IASxCaNoVbM

I also developed a free website for track comparison on my free time quantified-self.io and I bet also other people in the world. For every free webservice that is out that does not mean that a Suunto person is doing something bad.

Droro

@Dimitrios-Kanellopoulos I wasn’t talking about you. So you are saying suunto management all use SA, and are happy with what they are using? How do you explain the discrepancy between them and practically everyone on this forum?
We all paid to use SA by buying a suunto watch. It’s not free in that sense.

@ColdBeer said in Incompetent graphs:

Is it in the user when he claims because he feels something wrong?

agree and think it’s not at all the end user to be blame if he noticed such serious error like this…

Dimitrios Kanellopoulos

@Droro its called transition period from Service A to Service B.
And yes that is the worse time for all of us including Suunto.

Movescount as we all know works well today and might be for quite a few time, and here we facilitate the place for the next service to be taken forwards by the community .

Droro

@Dimitrios-Kanellopoulos why does suunto tell all spartan/9 users in no ambiguous terms that SA is for them and not movescount? You can check yourself, that is on the apps. (mc/SA).
It is the worst time for suunto because they encourage users to help them with the transition by becoming unwilling beta testers, which harm their training and reduces data availability. That’s a nono, never make customers beta testers. (unless they volunteer)

Dimitrios Kanellopoulos

@Droro there is not beta testing atm. Suunto app is the official app from Suunto. If the data visualization has problems that is understandable and clearly acknowledged from Suunto as I told you it’s the next iteration to come.

Droro

@Dimitrios-Kanellopoulos if it was just data visualization then OK. But, hr data wasted, no interval training on the app, and a bunch of other things mentioned here which make me believe it is in a beta stage in an unofficial manner. That is at least how I feel. having said that, it does at least work for the most part, if you look at Google play comments, many people give it 5 stars because it works (sync with watch mainly). Is that a reason for five stars? Not imo.

@Dimitrios-Kanellopoulos said in Incompetent graphs:

Hi let me announce this

great, we have a mini-roadmap now they might take a look at quantified-self.io for the graphs
as these translucent surfaces along the rider on top with the actual metrics, as this is looking awesome!

small question remains: who had this great idea with ‘non-linear’ time for plotting graphs and rendering the result graphical useless? Majority (not saying all) of sport activity are determined by time so it’s a quite crucial fact to visualize this properly and for you to be able to learn something form these graphs, isn’t it?

ColdBeer

@Dimitrios-Kanellopoulos To be sincere, your “work day” (sorry, and please put a difference with your “private day”) has got a relative importance for me. I appreciate -sincerely- your efforts trying to involve “the dome” in a better app, and your work on QS (which is, AFAIK, a private and personal development).

But as I said one year ago, this is a kind of a circus (and sorry for the comparison, I don’t try to disrespect no one), where the ringmaster (you) tries to do his best with a big effort, while managers doesn’t spend a penny on the circus, and workers are totally lost and depressed. That’s my imagination, but with some answers here in this forum, it seems that some of you are trying to shut up those users who tell “hey! the elephant is just two man with a bad costume” or “wow! the amazon -horsewoman- is an 80 years old woman with no abilities to ride a horse!!!”. If, month after month the “show” is still the same… and some clients repeats the same critic… THE FAULT IS IN THE CLIENTS? REALLY?

Users/Clients made his job: collaborate, inform, critic, buying watches, and put their best testing the app (sometimes even losing data).

Suunto is the one who DIDN’T MAKE HIS JOB. That’s my POV, and it’s simply.

ColdBeer

@Dimitrios-Kanellopoulos said in Incompetent graphs:

@Droro its called transition period from Service A to Service B.
And yes that is the worse time for all of us including Suunto.

Movescount as we all know works well today and might be for quite a few time, and here we facilitate the place for the next service to be taken forwards by the community .

In my past life as network administrator and software engineer, transitions start JUST WHEN every capabilities and features and so on works RIGHT. Never a transition from a stable app to a “BETA app”.

Dimitrios Kanellopoulos

@Tobias-F said in Incompetent graphs:

@Dimitrios-Kanellopoulos said in Incompetent graphs:

Hi let me announce this

great, we have a mini-roadmap now they might take a look at quantified-self.io for the graphs
as these translucent surfaces along the rider on top with the actual metrics, as this is looking awesome!

small question remains: who had this great idea with ‘non-linear’ time for plotting graphs and rendering the result graphical useless? Majority (not saying all) of sport activity are determined by time so it’s a quite crucial fact to visualize this properly and for you to be able to learn something form these graphs, isn’t it?

Tell me about it ¯_(ツ)_/¯

Dimitrios Kanellopoulos

@ColdBeer said in Incompetent graphs:

@Dimitrios-Kanellopoulos To be sincere, your “work day” (sorry, and please put a difference with your “private day”) has got a relative importance for me. I appreciate -sincerely- your efforts trying to involve “the dome” in a better app, and your work on QS (which is, AFAIK, a private and personal development).

But as I said one year ago, this is a kind of a circus (and sorry for the comparison, I don’t try to disrespect no one), where the ringmaster (you) tries to do his best with a big effort, while managers doesn’t spend a penny on the circus, and workers are totally lost and depressed. That’s my imagination, but with some answers here in this forum, it seems that some of you are trying to shut up those users who tell “hey! the elephant is just two man with a bad costume” or “wow! the amazon -horsewoman- is an 80 years old woman with no abilities to ride a horse!!!”. If, month after month the “show” is still the same… and some clients repeats the same critic… THE FAULT IS IN THE CLIENTS? REALLY?

Users/Clients made his job: collaborate, inform, critic, buying watches, and put their best testing the app (sometimes even losing data).

Suunto is the one who DIDN’T MAKE HIS JOB. That’s my POV, and it’s simply.

There is no fault on the clients. Not at all and I did not imply that.

I would like not to expose internal procedures but I would rather comfort you saying that the forum is the place for feedback and prioritization when it’s time.

You said

If, month after month the “show” is still the same… and some clients repeats the same critic… THE FAULT IS IN THE CLIENTS? REALLY?

No the fault is not the clients at all (saying this one more time), however, personally seing that the client is frustrated I take one of my advantages (that I still have to fight for personally) and offer the client a refund. Perhaps the future, or lets say after x amount of time the client might come back.

To come each start of the week in this forum, seeing client X saying the same, idk but to me feels that this person is not adding anything here and rather he needs some resolution now.Especially when he dominates the conversations with the same arguments. Since here is not customer care chat, please do tell me what you are asking for with each start of the week asking the same…

Droro

@Dimitrios-Kanellopoulos I for one can live (at least for a while) with route planning on SA, and data analysis on runalyze. Seems like this is suunto plan, just enable 3rd party. (including for old watches) I imagine they are counting on 3rd party to be free if that’s the case, which may prove to be false over time.

ColdBeer

@Dimitrios-Kanellopoulos said in Incompetent graphs:

To come each start of the week in this forum, seeing client X saying the same, idk but to me feels that this person is not adding anything here and rather he needs some resolution now.Especially when he dominates the conversations with the same arguments. Since here is not customer care chat, please do tell me what you are asking for with each start of the week asking the same…

Again, Dimitrios, do you really think I wake up in the morning trying to shoot someone? Really? Not, I spent a lot of effort trying to show what are the main issues on this app, and the first one is to be an “open beta” -as it’s little mature for that- and the second -but bigger- is to involve it as the main solution right now for clients. As none of those main problems are still solved.

And yes, agree too: I’m terribly frustrated and furious right now. I see I tried my best for helping here, being one of the firsts testers of the app, and even seeing the app is still far from being a solution for one of the three best sport watches brand. The brand for what I bet.

Dimitrios Kanellopoulos

@ColdBeer to be honest i understand but i dont understand how saying the same in every possible thread can help. I would like yo hear other user opinions as well. Why dont you give space to others to be heard and have to monopolize with your opinion ?

@ColdBeer
My two cents.
Let’s assume SA does not exist. I will personally revisit in 6 months and reconsider. I have totally bought into the suunto ecosystem. Currently have 5 watches.
I am not expecting miracles, nor am I happy with the general direction.
BUT, there is nothing we can do. At least in this forum. FB and other social media are a different thing. No-one can silence us over there.
We tried voicing our concerns and we are experiencing a backlash.
Let’s leave it as is.

sartoric

@Yannis-Belouris

out of curiosity … what you would expect to happen ?
I don’t mean as a reaction to your last words, but generally speaking.

… except something like “a delivery of new feature every week” that would be as wonderful as irrealistic

@ColdBeer and @Droro
And now compare to e.g. Garmin. There is a forum too, but no community managers or developers take care of what the customers are saying. It is just a user forum. You can do feature suggestions, complain about not working functions…whatever you want. Garmin does not care about that.

Suunto listens to the customers here in this forum. What we bring up will be addressed to the developers and prioritized in the backlog. Whenever a use case can fit into their sprints and be delivered as a working package, they will develop it and send it to us.

Keep calm and if the Suunto App does not fit your needs, there are so many alternatives to use. Stay with the older Movescount, use Strava, subscribe to TrainingPeaks, buy WKO4 and dive deep into your trainings on your own. I prefer the last 2 options for myself to track and analyze my training.

And just to get to know about my background: I worked 6 years as an admin for a global Citrix environment and for 7 years now as a Computer System Validation Engineer. I know about software development as well as following regulatory procedures for Pharma companies that must be fulfilled.

Dimitrios Kanellopoulos

@Yannis-Belouris said in Incompetent graphs:

@ColdBeer
My two cents.
Let’s assume SA does not exist. I will personally revisit in 6 months and reconsider. I have totally bought into the suunto ecosystem. Currently have 5 watches.
I am not expecting miracles, nor am I happy with the general direction.
BUT, there is nothing we can do. At least in this forum. FB and other social media are a different thing. No-one can silence us over there.
We tried voicing our concerns and we are experiencing a backlash.
Let’s leave it as is.

Can you explain to me how :

We tried voicing our concerns and we are experiencing a backlash.

That is all you understood from all this?

I even have started to ack most of the requests and shared that all development is Stewart towards your votes on this forum.

I am now really down about this personally.

Dimitrios Kanellopoulos

@Yannis-Belouris said in Incompetent graphs:

No-one can silence us over there.

I am very mispleased to read this… Who has silenced you? Can you explain? In detail