Software update 2.39.20 (2024 Q4)

[wmichi]

@Łukasz-Szmigiel said in Software update 2.39.20 (2024 Q4):

Lack of public testing on a wide group of users. Current public release should have been a public beta, open for two weeks for testing that would be enough for the OHR bug to emerge.

I think Coros does a good job with this (better than Garmin). Before the quarterly production firmware update there is an open public beta testing. There is no final release date communicated, as it depends on the beta testing. And during the open beta test bugfixes are released if necessary, so that users can also test the fixes. They always provide a blog post outlining new features so everybody knows what to test.

Suunto is the complete opposite. Everything is a big secrecy (there aren’t even release notes for beta SA updates) and in the end everybody is surprised if the limited number of beta testers don’t find every bug.

After this OHR debacle Suunto should also think about public beta testing. In the end everyone wins: early adopters can play around with new features, user have the impression that their feedback counts and we all get a more stable product. There are so many people who really like Suunto products and could give valuable feedback. We all want Suunto to succeed, don’t we?

But I know that implementing open beta tests is not a trivial task.

[Łukasz Szmigiel]

@wmichi this sounds ideal.

[Inge Nallsson]

@wmichi This is also my experience. Coros get a gold star for their open beta implementations (and for very stable final FW releases). Garmin get a tinpot halfstar for the beta releases and for ignoring most of the userfound bugs.

[maszop]

Software testing in the case of Suunto is a total disgrace. For several last releases now there is always some major disaster, inability to synchronize with the phone, battery drain (still not resolved), now OHR and WiFi not working.
The problem with the contour lines and navigation messages has not been solved for over a year. There is still no proper support for several Bluetooth devices, but we have new colours, new watch faces and other fancy carousels in the menu.

I don’t know if there is anything positive to write about the testers. Incompetence or there are too few of them.
There is definitely a huge problem with the quality of the software and the way it is tested and released.

[Łukasz Szmigiel]

@maszop said in Software update 2.39.20 (2024 Q4):

Incompetence or there are too few of them.

I think it’s more of a systematic problem - not related to the people.

[maszop]

@Łukasz-Szmigiel But when reporting a problem on the forum, testers often deny it and blame the user or the hardware itself. So you can come to different conclusions.
Since the Suunto 9 Peak Pro I have written (and not only me) about problems with measuring elevation gain in strong winds and the answer is always that there is no problem.
There were a few similar cases.

[GiPFELKiND]

@MKPotts downgrade actually is the best Option for me, too. Until suunto solve some existing problems

[GiPFELKiND]

@maszop you are right, but some suunto “testers” Here everytime Posts: they dont have this Problems… Now you know all about some Software problems if the Suunto testers dont have our Problems, the Software rolls out sorry Joke ends Here.

[maszop]

@GiPFELKiND A tester’s job is to find bugs in software. If they never find them, or even deny them, maybe they should do something else?

[wakarimasen]

@maszop said in Software update 2.39.20 (2024 Q4):

@GiPFELKiND A tester’s job is to find bugs in software. If they never find them, or even deny them, maybe they should do something else?

This is rather curious statement. I work with software (in a way) and sometimes problems occur that cannot be reproduced. This isn’t necessarily the problem of the tester and is almost always more related to the application itself. When you consider the number of different variables in the watches (and use cases) it’s no wonder that some issues slip under the radar. I’m not talking about the most recent update (before a pile-on starts). I’m just saying that we shouldn’t start to blame the ‘testers’ for not finding all bugs.
Software is never bug-free - that’s pretty much a fact of life.
In the meantime, it’s much more important to be outdoors running/ walking/ cycling/ skiing etc. than worrying about heart rate tracking failing in the middle of a session. The world still turns, and hopefully you enjoyed the activity anyway. That was the whole point. after all

[Brad_Olwin]

@MKPotts said in Software update 2.39.20 (2024 Q4):

Is there are news on Suunto issuing an official firmware rollback for the S9PP, that was mentioned in this thread about 10 days ago?

I’m now only 7 days from a race that will take me about 35hrs, where I intended to use the S9PP as my primary navigation device, with a watch that drains 6-7%/hour in performance mode since (and only since) the firmware update.

I’ve seen the posts explaining how to complete an “unofficial” rollback but I’m reluctant to do that in case it 1) bricks the watch (is this likely/a real risk?) and/or 2) I successfully roll back only to find the watch forces the update before my race and (worst case) I don’t realise until it fails partway through my race.

You will not have problems rolling back firmware. I’ve done this quite a bit.

[sorinus]

@wmichi 100% agree, most of the problems could be avoided through public beta testing. I hope Suunto will consider implementing a public beta testing process.

[Łukasz Szmigiel]

@wakarimasen said in Software update 2.39.20 (2024 Q4):

When you consider the number of different variables in the watches (and use cases) it’s no wonder that some issues slip under the radar

So, perhaps there aren’t enough testers, or maybe a beta program should be in action prior to the public release?

[wakarimasen]

@Łukasz-Szmigiel said in Software update 2.39.20 (2024 Q4):

@wakarimasen said in Software update 2.39.20 (2024 Q4):

When you consider the number of different variables in the watches (and use cases) it’s no wonder that some issues slip under the radar

So, perhaps there aren’t enough testers, or maybe a beta program should be in action prior to the public release?

Wouldn’t disagree with that, but the previous comment was quite different

[wmichi]

@wakarimasen For firmware updates: Development -> internal testing (some field testers)-> private beta (the whole field tester club) -> public beta (open to everyone interested) -> public release. As you said, there are a lot of variables/use cases, that’s why testing with a lot more people makes sense. But there needs to be a dedicated feedback channel. Support should not be bothered with beta users.

[wakarimasen]

@wmichi Sounds good to me!

[Sergey Balbir]

One more bug I have noticed since the update.
It supposed to be 16150 (Instead of |6150)
But it is minor

[Łukasz Szmigiel]

@wakarimasen which comment are you referring to?

[wakarimasen]

@Łukasz-Szmigiel
Screenshot 2025-01-04 at 21.27.07

Sorry - not sure how to quote into a reply.

[Peter Pan 0]

Since the latest software update the HR Sensor fails all the time. Doesn’t even last 24h without it stopping.
Soft reset solved it a few times. But even after a hard reset i.e. all data is lost and back to factory settings HR still stops working after a few hours.
Unfortunately can’t roll back to earlier software.
On top battery life becomes worse with every update. When I first bought it I was impressed how long it lasted. Actually very long.
Now it’s the same as my old suunto 5 that needs recharging every week.
Very disappointed