Stryd

isazi

@RightNow it’s native, plus there is a S+ coming. The app includes the other metrics, the native support only power, or power+cadence+pace. Yes you can use structured workouts with power.

@RightNow I believe Suunto has the best Stryd compatibility, bar none, especially in the context of a wider platform and sports watch features. Trust me, I tried all others:

Stryd power displayed natively when the accessory is paired as a footpod
Ability to add power and derivatives, aka 3 sec power, 10 sec power, lap power, etc. everywhere as your data fields as many times as you want
Running power zones, with ability to set your intensity target based on power and update it during the workout
Consequently, alerts based on power zone targets
Intervals based on running power
If you use stuff like ActiveLook glasses, current power will be displayed there as well, automatically
Full support for running power structured workouts, either created within Suunto app or imported from elsewhere like Training Peaks

The only thing that’s missing are the other advanced Stryd metrics like vertical oscillation or wind power during a run. That said, do you really need them while running? And yes, rumors of S+ app for that are swirling. At the moment, Suunto would automatically upload the workout to Stryd, and you then sync your Stryd pod using the Stryd app. Your workout in PowerCenter will be merged with the Stryd’s pod data automatically resulting in a single workout that has all Stryd data and distance/pace calibrated to GPS.

Now, with COROS you can arguably get older Stryd metrics like oscillation natively. Newer ones like wind power and LBSS aren’t supported, will not be shown on the watch, and will not be sent to Stryd. No workout merge exists. So, you effectively have to choose between either using Stryd app pod sync and losing GPS/heart rate data, or having workouts sent by COROS and losing all new Stryd stats. My understanding after talking to Stryd is this was COROS decision to stop supporting new Stryd features. On top of that, other long standing limitations like no structured workouts and map/route guidance can be used together still stand.

In Garmin, you don’t have Stryd running power natively, period. Which means you either have to use a data field and lose structured workouts, zones, and alerts. Or you have to rely on Stryd app for Garmin devices, but it has too many issues of its own. There are other hacks available, like running with a biking profile, but hey… That’s just ridiculous.

@isazi said in Stryd:

@RightNow it’s native, plus there is a S+ coming.

Do you know if it’s just an S+ app similar to Training Peaks ones that displays other Stryd metrics and perhaps allows to automatically sync them all to Stryd Power Center, - OR - we will get S+ guides for their training plans/calendar?

I said it elsewhere and I will repeat it here. Given Garmin and COROS both effectively blocked Stryd development on their platforms, Suunto is the natural platform for Stryd to go. I understand they have a really good Apple Watch app, but just like with Garmin, it’s not a native workout app and it misses too much you’d expect to get from a sports watch.

RightNow

Many thanks for all the information. In summary: The support is great except I have to do an offline sync (That’s acceptable). And the upcoming Suunto plus app is at least promising (because we don’t know what’s included).

Order is placed

@RightNow Well, offline sync isn’t an amazing requirement, but it takes 10-15 sec at most and I have to go Stryd app anyways to add shoe information, set workout type, etc.

I believe it’s a decent trade-off for having all the features above, your workout in Training Peaks with clean* Stryd power data, and full workout details in Power Center.

(* By clean I mean you have only Stryd power data in your file. If you are using Garmin, there’s no way to disable Garmin running power for Stryd app, so both data streams get exported. And while Runalyze would ignore Garmin’s data and use Stryd, TP is kind of a mixed bag. In some places they use Stryd data and in others – like summaries – they use Garmin’s. Total mess.)

herlas

I’d say if you’re new to running power, SV wrist-based should be a good enough starting point. If you have STRYD already and believe you don’t need it, that’s probably true, everyone has different needs/requirements.

In my case, I made the switch to power-based training couple of years back and love it, it keeps me pushing forward. FTP is a moving metric depending on my current level of fitness. It’s motivational for me as well, receiving FTP updates after a PR race or hard workout is so much fun too.

I own the next Gen STRYD and looking forward to the Stryd S+ app.

My only issue on the Suunto side is the power zone Z4 upper limit being the fixed value for FTP. As a result, I have to set TSS from TP to all my Suunto workouts all the time, as my FTP is not by any means close to that Z4 upper limit.

Options are great to have, if you want to take a full transition to running with power, my opinion is that any wrist-based power isn’t probably enough,it’s just a small taste

isazi

@NickK said in Stryd:

Do you know if it’s just an S+ app similar to Training Peaks ones that displays other Stryd metrics and perhaps allows to automatically sync them all to Stryd Power Center, - OR - we will get S+ guides for their training plans/calendar?

As far as I know, it shows the metrics and saves them to activity (so you see them in SA too). For the training plans, I think they do not need a special app, Stryd could just create guides like other parties do.

@isazi Yes, I meant S+ guides for Stryd. When you say it saves, I assume it saves the entire time series, not just some summaries or what not? So, there’s no longer a need for offline sync and auto-merge?

isazi

@NickK that’s my assumption, I can test it during the weekend.

seanvk

@NickK That’s a great summary on the support and has been my experience using Stryd with Garmin and Suunto. But now with native running power, I’ve just been using my 8020Endurance running plans (power based) on TP without Stryd entirely. I do recognize that I’ll periodically need to do running tests to adjust my ftp, but I do that anyway as a part of the 8020Endurance training plans.

seanvk

@herlas said in Stryd:

My only issue on the Suunto side is the power zone Z4 upper limit being the fixed value for FTP. As a result, I have to set TSS from TP to all my Suunto workouts all the time, as my FTP is not by any means close to that Z4 upper limit.

This is a challenge with all device makers. Device makers try to define zones that work best with their their training and load methodologies. When a user is working with a third party training plan which defines its own zones, it’s like trying to merge multiple different paradigms. Stryd has theirs and so does Matt Fitzgerald’s 80/20.

It’s a no win scenario

seanvk

@seanvk just to add that the real saving grace here is that TP sends only the power ranges for each segment. It still messes with device maker’s zone mapping. But if you use external platforms like TP, FS, and Intervals.icu you can set your zones from a range of methodologies. You do your post workout analysis there and not through Sunnyo’s SA or Garmin’s Connect.

@seanvk I follow 80/20 zones too.

So, my solution is to anchor my 4/5 zone in the watch to the top of my Zone 3 in Training Peaks (i.e. 3/Y in 80/20 lingo). That gives me accurate pTSS/rTSS/hrTSS in Suunto app without any need for updating TSS in workouts to make them match what I have in TP. The lower zones like X, 2, and 1 then follow. The top zones get all lumped up into 5 in the watch, which is fine as it is unlikely I’ll ever be targeting any of them outside the intervals/repeats anyways. And I can still use lower “gears” for my intensity targets on recovery/easy/long runs without structured workouts.

For training, I’m relying on TP and expressing all my intensities as % of pace/power threshold, and so the exact zones are somewhat of a moot point. Stryd gets my TP workouts and is able to show how well I match the power targeted just fine. Most of their analytics is driven by time spent at % of CP.

The only thing that is broken in this scheme of things is time spent in specific Stryd zones. Well, you can’t have everything!

herlas

@seanvk power zones are one thing, TSS calculation doesn’t uses power zones at all, it’s relative to the % of FTP used during your workout and its length.

TP allows you to set FTP alone, and you can set whatever power zones schema you want.

@herlas said in Stryd:

TP allows you to set FTP alone, and you can set whatever power zones schema you want.

I think the problem people have is that for TSS to work properly in Suunto watches FTP has to be anchored in 4/5 zone boundary while Stryd, for example, puts it into 3/4. Hence, if you want your watch zones match your Stryd zones for training, your TSS and other analysis – like Coach stuff – will be off.

RightNow

Too confusing to me what was written. If I am using a TrainingPeaks plan. What is to be done to run excactly the plan with the power Ranges described in TrainingPeaks?
What issues are expected?
I can’t follow you

herlas

@NickK that’s exactly what I’ve described as my only issue on the Suunto side, until FTP can be set alone, meaning not dependant of power zones, people will have to do what either you do, adjusting Z4 to fall into your FTP value or what I do, adjusting TSS on Suunto workout every single time as it gets undercalculated. (I opt for the last as I find the power zones ring and power zone targets so useful on my Suunto watch )

herlas

@RightNow long history short, if your FTP isn’t matching the Suunto Z4 upper limit, the Suunto watch will underestimate your TSS for any given workout, TP will show you the correct TSS though.

As far as the workout execution, nothing changes you should be fine there

seanvk

@herlas said in Stryd:

@seanvk power zones are one thing, TSS calculation doesn’t uses power zones at all, it’s relative to the % of FTP used during your workout and its length.

TP allows you to set FTP alone, and you can set whatever power zones schema you want.

Yes, I do that. I set 80/20 zones and my FTP in TP and intervals.icu. I just don’t pay attention to SA due to their zone definition.

RightNow

Sorry that I have to ask again. What I understand is that I can use Stryd structured workouts described in TrainingPeaks and everything will be fine. The only thing is to do the offline sync.

Now the topic I don’t understand excactly. What I have to care about is to align the power setting on my new vertical watch. Right? Between zone 4 and 5 should be the FTP.
But still I have the feeling from your writing/posts before that still something will be wrong or not usable with those settings. Right or wrong?