Suunto 7 **double** proposed elevation gain 6/6 trails!

eurohiker

I am a new Suunto user I have noticed my elevations being completely off after doing 6 different trails in 2 weeks. No wind, my suunto 7 has not been wet (no soap/water/anything), and my sleeves are not covering the barometer hole. Trails were all done in a t-shirt.

I will be listing the Alltrails link where I grabbed the remade trail GPX file and the overview trail stats, suunto’s GPX file link, and my recording which is set on to 1 sec tracking (if that matters), these were all using the hiking setting within the Suunto 7 WearOS app.

Vallon de l’Ours, Cap Sugiton, Grotte Bleue (proposed elevation gain 638m)

= watch said I climbed 2x more than i did

Forêt des Cèdres and Arche du Portalas (proposed 221m elevation gain but I doubled it)
https://www.alltrails.com/explore/trail/france/provence-alpes-cote-d-azur/foret-des-cedres-et-arche-du-portalas
https://www.suunto.com/fr-fr/move/krishehl/6016a1349a112c12d3a0d0be
https://api.sports-tracker.com/apiserver/v2/routes/export/MGFpV2MxdVNqeW5YL2d1SUxZYUUxbFk4dmxNZHdyRXJCYks5dTNBT2Z4OD0=?brand=SUUNTOAPP
Les Goudes, Col de la Selle and Col du Brès Loop (proposed elevation gain 863m, it says i did 1900m adding both those links which is insane)
https://www.alltrails.com/explore/trail/france/provence-alpes-cote-d-azur/circuit-les-goudes-col-de-la-selle-et-col-du-bres
https://api.sports-tracker.com/apiserver/v2/routes/export/bW9vRXJ1TW9rbmxhVXlnbXhGbmpkY0wwcjBmSUZ6MFp1S2VrTnJNZ2w0dz0=?brand=SUUNTOAPP
Watch crashed which is why this hike is split into 2 recordings explained in this thread
https://www.suunto.com/move/krishehl/601fc3574cc02f21a6e4a1d8
https://www.suunto.com/move/krishehl/601fe421cb1df22de8f1f659
Gorges d’Oppedette (217m but i doubled it)
https://www.alltrails.com/explore/trail/france/provence-alpes-cote-d-azur/gorges-doppedette
https://api.sports-tracker.com/apiserver/v2/routes/export/QnRMeFI3RlpSMEtXYTVNbTk4dCtza0JzMTJhOFllZjNyUWRuS0k2MVFNYz0=?brand=SUUNTOAPP
https://www.suunto.com/move/krishehl/60167d1e8a70d02f420598bc
Vallon de l’Ours, Cap Sugiton, Grotte Bleue (638m doubled elevation to 1200m)
https://www.alltrails.com/explore/trail/france/provence-alpes-cote-d-azur/vallon-de-l-ours-cap-sugiton-grotte-bleue
https://www.suunto.com/move/krishehl/601eb36e9b979b2ea0894bc0
https://api.sports-tracker.com/apiserver/v2/routes/export/YzBYMmk1elVzeVY1V0lpZmNyanhBUGhONlRzUWJHZ3hpS3FBT2ptQXJqdz0=?brand=SUUNTOAPP
Rocher des Deux Trous (proposed 253m but watch says 511m)
https://www.alltrails.com/explore/trail/france/provence-alpes-cote-d-azur/rocher-des-deux-trous-depuis-saint-remy-de-provence
https://www.suunto.com/fr-fr/move/krishehl/60154b43a9c1c71f0a56783d

Am I doing something wrong? I have been using my phone to record hikes before using downloaded gpx on Alltrails and I have been getting almost exactly what alltrails estimated elevation.
All previous trails recorded with my phone (every date including and before Jan17 2021) as seen here
https://www.strava.com/athletes/41572177

Why is my watch so wrong? Which is supposed to be better due to better GPS support than my phone with an added barometer?

Is there a setting that I can choose not to use the barometer?

eurohiker

I decided to try downloading this Alti/Barometer app hoping that it can fix it. Even though I don’t know how it would resolve doubling my elevation gain issue.

https://forum.xda-developers.com/t/app-alti-barometer-app-w-tile-auto-calibration-notifications-and-more.4136449/page-4

isazi

Okay, if you get double elevation in all your activities either the watch is faulty (try to contact support), or you are doing something that is triggering the issue (e.g. pumping air in the baro sensor).

eurohiker

@isazi i’m going to try it this coming weekend ski touring.
I’m also going to record with Strava in the watch at the same time as the Suunto app. (is it possible to record on 2 apps at the same time on the watch? I know it will cause more battery drain).
Maybe Ill try a few hour snowshoe hike to test if the battery drain is too intense.

I wonder if strava gets the same statistics so I can find out if it’s a hardware or software issue. Before I contact tech support since I know they will just tell me to do a hard reset to cancel out a software issue. Unfortunately, I have a busy week coming up so I can’t do a reset.

Brad_Olwin

@eurohiker I have not had a problem like this with the S7, however, with an S9 baro if skin or clothing covers the baro sensor holes it can produce this type of problem. A telltale sign is a spiky elevation graph that is not smooth, the little spikes will add up and create a lot of elevation change. High wind directly onto the baro sensor has caused this in the past as well. I have done a lot of ski touring with the S7 without issues. Check to make sure that the baro sensor holes will not be blocked by your skin when you use your poles. If that is possible then switch which arm you wear the watch on.

eurohiker

@brad_olwin This is when I was hiking but I’ll make sure to check while skiing next weekend.
Note that in this picture i don’t even put my jacket under the watch it’s actually naturally sits under the 4-5mm clearance.
I actually noticed the altitude graph being completely off so I decided to take a picture. This picture suunto watch.jpg
was taken in the morning no wind, but a bit cool with the jacket at the start of the hike. The jacket was off in the first 30min

After my first weekend i noticed after each hike that my elevation was insane. Then I read the forums and I didnt stumble upon “i have not issue comment” this is actually the reason why I decided to add the no wind, soap, water, and wearing a t-shirt in the OP.

With the bone structure of my wrist. There is actually a space between the back/front of the watch in all positions but maintaining great HB sensor contact. Covering the barometer with skin would be impossible with my wrists. It’s actually hard to cover the sensor while wearing a sweater, hoodie, spring, shell jacket due 2-5mm clearance in every wrist position. The only way I can cover the sensor is if I purposely tried to. Very good design choice for Suunto there.

Brad_Olwin

@eurohiker You could have a faulty unit, same for me, my skin cannot cover the baro hole on the S7 but it does on the S9 if I am using poles and have a large bend in the wrist. Try making sure the S7 is under a jacket for your ski tour and not on top of any fabric. There have been faulty baro sensors on the S7 reported by other users here and replaced so that is a possibility.

eurohiker

@brad_olwin damn the clearance was definitely a good design choice

eurohiker

Looking closer to this picture. I’m seeing 1053m elevation left of the hike. This was within the first hour during the first ascent.

This is actually part of #2 i posted which was supposed to be 863m total elevation :

“Les Goudes, Col de la Selle and Col du Brès Loop (proposed elevation gain 863m, it says i did 1900m adding both those links which is insane)
https://www.alltrails.com/explore/trail/france/provence-alpes-cote-d-azur/circuit-les-goudes-col-de-la-selle-et-col-du-bres
https://api.sports-tracker.com/apiserver/v2/routes/export/bW9vRXJ1TW9rbmxhVXlnbXhGbmpkY0wwcjBmSUZ6MFp1S2VrTnJNZ2w0dz0=?brand=SUUNTOAPP
Watch crashed which is why this hike is split into 2 recordings explained in this thread
https://www.suunto.com/move/krishehl/601fc3574cc02f21a6e4a1d8
https://www.suunto.com/move/krishehl/601fe421cb1df22de8f1f659”

eurohiker

CRITICAL UPDATE:
Tried ski touring this weekend, we just when up the hill once and went down the same run that we climbed.
https://www.suunto.com/move/krishehl/60281b80b169987ef7641bcc

The run from base to chalet is roughly 600m which the graph clearly shows. Contour lines and elevation chart shows that i started just under 1400m and reached 2000m (L’ARAVET 2000).

Near the top my watch said around 650m elevation (on the elevation tooth; should have taken a picture). To me, this looks like a suunto app post processing issue and less of a barometre hardware issue. The altitude graph was right but the app analyzed it completely wrong. I’m surprised more people haven’t seen this issue because, to me, it looks like a big fundamental coding error. @Dimitrios-Kanellopoulos

Note: The descent line is straight because i paused it at the top for a break but forgot to turn it back on until half way down the run.
Still no auto-paused/resume like Strava.

Sidenote2: I also downloaded XDA alti-baro app just for the ski touring hike. The watch was definitely in line with the listed altitudes like 2000m at L’ARAVET 2000.

Mff73

@eurohiker
maybe have a look more closer at your data first.
your activity altitude data looks a little wavy
if i import your activity, and just looked at your summit data, you have 245m ascent.

So maybe the issue is more on watch, or the way you wear it, or …, but SA seems just to show the data it has from your watch.

eurohiker

@mff73 wow thanks, i don’t know how to make the altitude graph that big. So it’s adding all those “wavy” dips into the total ascent. Since, this time i was only going up with the occasional wide ski touring turn to preserve energy on the climb.
That makes sense then.

I really want to avoid sending this to Suunto. I travel every weekend and it always involves hiking. The site says it takes 3 weeks and costs me 41euro and I might have to pay more which is awful customer service. I really should just be getting a new unit or fixed for free.

Mff73

@eurohiker said in Suunto 7 **double** proposed elevation gain 6/6 trails!:

@mff73 wow thanks, i don’t know how to make the altitude graph that big. So it’s adding all those “wavy” dips into the total ascent. Since, this time i was only going up with the occasional wide ski touring turn to preserve energy on the climb.
That makes sense then.

I really want to avoid sending this to Suunto. I travel every weekend and it always involves hiking. The site says it takes 3 weeks and costs me 41euro which is awful customer service. It’s not my fault i overpaid 400euro for a defect.

first advice : create an account in https://quantified-self.io/ and sync your SA with it you will be able to see these kind of details, and much more.

second advice : clean your baro sensor (find in this forum for more details, but in brief, put your watch in warm water, and let it some times, then rince, and insist in baro holes to make sure water comes in and out).

third advice : once your baro sensor is sure to be cleaned, do another test and be sure the baro holes are not covered and/or not too much wind blows.

fourth advice : if your device is under waranty, you won’t be charge to any cost with suunto support. And if the period is OK, it could take only a few days to come back if it is proven that your sensor if faulty (but these days, delays are what they are )

Mff73

@eurohiker
and, regarding your signature :

please read here, there is a link
https://forum.suunto.com/post/2534

and finally, “Salut les Hautes-Alpes”

eurohiker

@mff73 @mff73 thanks for the steps!

My Suunto hasn’t been in water yet (other than a few rain droplets), not even a shower, but i’ll try it anyways! Maybe dust from shipping
Love the quantified-self site.
haven’t had any wind yet actually. Quite lucky on weather.
-Thanks for the beta
thanks for that last tidbit i was just going off what they said here suunto repari services link

salut

eurohiker

So i received a brand new Suunto 7 watch from Suunto but I’m getting the same issues. 5km/h of wind rolled up sleeves with baro hole fully exposed left wrist.

GPX files taken from Alltrails

https://www.alltrails.com/explore/trail/france/hautes-pyrenees/lac-de-gaube-via-pont-d-espagne?mobileMap=false&ref=sidebar-static-map&ref=sidebar-view-full-map

660m up and down (doubling the ascent and descent of the GPX file)

Wikiloc corrected the ascent and descent (358m up and down). This is what the watch should have read

https://www.wikiloc.com/hiking-trails/cauterets-67422222

My alpine ski day seems to be fine 6000m descent, 16 runs = 375m average descent at Soldeu/El Tartar, Andorra. The gradients were completely off (like wayyyyy off) with the runs but the ascent/descent seems to be ok.

Luckily i don’t care about the gradients as much but yea Blue run 25%-40% gradients are and red run gradients are 30%-45%. Fatmap said my max gradient was 23% when I was on some closed black runs/off piste. 23% is green run territory which i don’t think that resort even had green runs open.

Comparing the self quantified. The hiking data is very wavy but the ski data was not wavy at all. You could clearly see the chairlifts were straight and the downhill was a consistent decline when zoomed in.

Since I already sent the watch back and got a new one with the same issues. What do I do now?

freeheeler

@eurohiker
is it possible that your QS links are not public?
The graph in SA looks a bit wavey, but I think we already discussed the “block baro holes” issue, right?

Bulkan

@eurohiker the links in qs are public? I can’t view the activities.

The hiking. activity math In suunto app and strava… why do you say is wrong? Because a gpx file says it?

eurohiker

@freeheeler sorry they are public now.
I haven’t soaked this in water yet. To make sure there wasn’t dust in the baro hole during shipping.

eurohiker

@bulkan QS is public now sorry.
Suunto agreed with me because without question they sent me a new one after looking at it for less than a day so my guess is they just looked at my data that i sent them seperately and saw it was messed up and sent a new one. This one seems to be doing the exact same thing.

Walking the exact same trail should not double the ascent and descent compared to the GPX file downloaded. Also, look how wavy my data is.