Closing of Movescount is delayed further to 2021
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Ha! Possibly. I’ll believe it when I see it. I would prefer to stick with Suunto. My daily driver Essentials would prefer to continue to have a Suunto sports watch to match.
Been waiting 2 years for Suunto to get with the program. I tried the Spartan WHR baro and went back to the Ambit after being unhappy with the GPS accuracy and the lack of on watch POI creation. So we’ll see. Being able to alter my POI list in the backcountry is primary. That’s only possible with Ambit/Traverse at this point. Second is the altitude profile issue, MC has this broken currently with NO solution other than to switch to a newer watch and SA.
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@chrish @Mff73 We’ve been assured that it’s going to be special when it arrives so I’m assuming one or more of the following …
- Eye-tracking while perusing an on-screen map + telepathic POI naming.
- AR cross-hairs as you wave your phone camera across a paper map from an XY coordinate reference to your desired spot.
- Contour reading+interpolation, naturally.
- Really distinctive and locally appropriate font options. Maybe runes.
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What annoys me most about the last 2 years has been features getting released that are questionably useful and just total fluff. Like my Spartan all of a sudden asking me after I stop an activity ‘how to you feel’. WTF. Who cares. How about my GPS watch telling me how to get from point A to point B first. My backpacking buddy or a passer-by can ask me how I feel when I start vomiting.
It’s just maddening to see such a great product and product concept go this direction. And to have Suunto claim they are asking for user input here and in surveys. No way they are getting a satistically significant number of responses to make any legitimately GOOD decisions. Build what you advertised for and leave the rest on the cutting room floor until the core product is working.
It’s a GPS watch for athletes, adventure seekers, outdoors, meh kinda indoors. Seems to me the priority, and not that hard given Suunto’s history, would be the core items of Route, Elevation, POI, and gathering personal data like heart rate, ox, etc. If any of that stops working, you stop what you are doing and fix it. Then move back to the other stuff. But evidently not.
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@chrish Fortunately you can turn that Feeling question off in sport mode settings. Doing so gave me a good feeling I felt no desire to log. Although I am sharing it with you now, which might make either of us want to vomit.
And I don’t think you’ve got the Sx right (my mistake, too). They are for measuring essentially repeatable, predictable activities. That’s why the navigation system is geared to follow, precisely, pre-entered routes (preferably covered by someone else earlier - heatmapped). It may be why sleep-tracking had a higher priority in the app than POIs. That’s what gives athletes, etc., the statistics base (Hi, QS!) for their training.
Our POI trips are too individual to be statistically valid in the same way. Not the Sx deal. Perhaps the S9’s Bearing Navigation is a sign of Things To Come (Back).
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@Fenr1r yea, all probably true. I’ve said that before in other posts. That Suunto is headed the direction of providing for the serious amateur and professional athletes and their training data. And the outdoor crowd has been left behind. I guess if you are .02% body fat and running 25 miles a day w/ 10000ft of vert, you don’t care much about elevation profiles and getting from point A to point B.
Yes, I turned ‘how do you feel’ off immediately as well. Was just using that as an example of a stupid feature that shows up and could have well been left out entirely, for any use case. It’s the equivalent of counting steps.
Agreed, seeing that bearing nav was added to the S9 gave me hope of things to come.
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@chrish said in Closing of Movescount is delayed further to 2021:
… if you are .02% body fat and running 25 miles a day w/ 10000ft of vert, you don’t care much about elevation profiles and getting from point A to point B.
Apparently you do care, and to several decimal places. To predict energy use on every predicted gradient and not going an unnecessary foot outside that pre-measured route from A to B.
I get it. I just don’t get my outdoor kicks that way. I want to see stuff and go places as I feel (sorry) at the time. Occasionally even go places when I can’t see stuff (hence GPS navigation). And if I have to look at a flat, curved or even bumpy display referencing that activity, I’d rather it be a map than a spreadsheet or graph, no matter how clear or visually appealing DK makes them look.
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@Fenr1r
Ha! Yea, I guess somebody DOES care about that, at that level. I honestly should just stop whining and become more like John Muir. Wander the earth and not worry about where I am, how I’m going to get there, or whatever I’m going to do, sleep in, or eat along the way. The 21st century adventurer is most definitely not like the early 20th century adventurer!!!I missed the Sierras this year due COVID and fires. Too scared (for no good reason) of a possible griz encounter to go solo in the Winds in WY.
Maybe next year I’ll have a decent new fangled watch to protect me from all creatures great and small, and from cliffing out.
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@chrish said in Closing of Movescount is delayed further to 2021:
The 21st century adventurer is most definitely not like the early 20th century adventurer!!!
It’s mostly the development of equipment and clothing. Noone wears neckties in the bush anymore. Standards have gone to hell.
Reasonable excuses for missing the hills this year: fire and plague. And you were probably wise to be wary of bears: they cannot be relied upon to distance socially.
I hear Kalashnikov is working on a watch that can clear a 3-metre radius of every living thing around the wearer. But it doesn’t do cliffing alerts. And you can’t turn off the Feeling query.
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@chrish said in Closing of Movescount is delayed further to 2021:
What annoys me most about the last 2 years has been features getting released that are questionably useful and just total fluff. Like my Spartan all of a sudden asking me after I stop an activity ‘how to you feel’. WTF. Who cares. How about my GPS watch telling me how to get from point A to point B first. My backpacking buddy or a passer-by can ask me how I feel when I start vomiting.
It’s just maddening to see such a great product and product concept go this direction. And to have Suunto claim they are asking for user input here and in surveys. No way they are getting a satistically significant number of responses to make any legitimately GOOD decisions. Build what you advertised for and leave the rest on the cutting room floor until the core product is working.
It’s a GPS watch for athletes, adventure seekers, outdoors, meh kinda indoors. Seems to me the priority, and not that hard given Suunto’s history, would be the core items of Route, Elevation, POI, and gathering personal data like heart rate, ox, etc. If any of that stops working, you stop what you are doing and fix it. Then move back to the other stuff. But evidently not.
When you watch this you kinda understand the route suunto is taking
https://www.dcrainmaker.com/2020/10/dc-rainmaker-state-of-sports-tech-2020-keynote.html
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@André-Faria
You’ll have to sum that up. 45 minutes of Ray, ewww. But I can probably guess what he’s going to say. I’ve been saying here for awhile in the face of what Suunto is focused on. -
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@chrish said in Closing of Movescount is delayed further to 2021:
What annoys me most about the last 2 years has been features getting released that are questionably useful and just total fluff. Like my Spartan all of a sudden asking me after I stop an activity ‘how to you feel’. WTF. Who cares. How about my GPS watch telling me how to get from point A to point B first. My backpacking buddy or a passer-by can ask me how I feel when I start vomiting.
I am going to respond here. First, you can get from pt A to pt B on you watch if you wish. It can be done with POIs or a loaded route, how you feel can be used usefully. I use it for RPE, which according to some is the most accurate method to judge the severity of a workout.
It’s just maddening to see such a great product and product concept go this direction. And to have Suunto claim they are asking for user input here and in surveys. No way they are getting a satistically significant number of responses to make any legitimately GOOD decisions. Build what you advertised for and leave the rest on the cutting room floor until the core product is working.
So, provide your feedback in surveys but take note that not everyone may agree with you. In fact, maybe you are in the minority. Second, I doubt you know how many survey responses are recorded.
It’s a GPS watch for athletes, adventure seekers, outdoors, meh kinda indoors. Seems to me the priority, and not that hard you stop what you are doing and fix it. Then move back to the other stuff. But evidently not…
So, which watch are you using? My suunto9 baro provides routes, waypoints, hr, elevation data, recovery time, PTE, and more. I may not be an athlete but I do trail runs often that are 30k to 50k outdoors, off trail, and alone. Wish you had my watch, it is great for my activities.
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How do you get a POI onto any Suunto device with SA? How long has SA been out?
How do you enter a POI directly on the watch in the field without a laptop on ANY Suunto watch other than an Ambit or Traverse? How long has the Spartan/S series product line been out?
How do you get route elevation data onto an Ambit or Traverse? How long has this bug existed?
How do you get a route onto ANY Suunto watch without internet connectivity? Yes, this one has never been possible, just pointing out the lack of what should be a simple feature.
I’ve said all along that I’m an outlier. Backpacker and hiker. No debate there. But us outliers have had existing functionality removed and major bugs not fixed for nearly 2 years now. Are you saying that there is an app/watch combination right now that offers the same capability I had with my Ambit and MC from 2 years back?
BTW, you asked which watch. I’m still running an A3P. But I’ve owned a Vertical and Spartan WHR Baro. Dumped the Baro when it became clear that Suunto was never going to build the features into it that the A3P had and then started down this path w/ SA that was clear that it was going to hobble the Baro for an extended period of time possibly. Sold it while I could still get a few bucks for it. Should the S9 get POI mgmt from SA, it’s a strong contender, esp w/ this latest bearing lock addition.
You said I didn’t know how many surveys were completed. Agreed. But there were 2 sentences there. Are you saying that if they get, let’s pick a number, 100,000 responses that say they should build X, that then they should just not deliver capability that was included in marketing materials and user manuals now that they are dumping an entire platform.
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@Brad_Olwin said in Closing of Movescount is delayed further to 2021:
I am going to respond here. First, you can get from pt A to pt B on you watch if you wish. It can be done with POIs or a loaded route, how you feel can be used usefully. I use it for RPE, which according to some is the most accurate method to judge the severity of a workout.
It can currently be done with routes and POI’s, although the route creation is junk (for me) in the App, and degraded in MC (altitude profile). POIs can’t be done in the App yet and time will tell what solution they provide, but given their recent bias towards the fitness rather than nav market I won’t hold my breath as to how user friendly or useful it will be.
So, provide your feedback in surveys but take note that not everyone may agree with you. In fact, maybe you are in the minority.
So what if we’re in the minority? We bought a product with a specific set of features, and the closure of Movescount loses people a significant number of these features. As I’ve said before, voting as a ‘community’ via surveys etc is a way to generate new features but these should be in addition to what people already have. The patronisation from Suunto when people request what they’ve already got is crazy, ‘if you’re lucky you’ll maybe see it included in an upcoming release’, like we’re five years olds being given sweets.
Wish you had my watch, it is great for my activities.
Yup, it’s great for your activities. Yet again you fail to see that many other people have clearly bought these watches for use in a different way. The enhancements to the App so far clearly work for you, but that doesn’t mean they work for everyone, nor does it mean that the App is acceptable as it is. I wish I’d gone for the A3P rather than the Spartan as the A3P does nav better without the need for a clunky touch screen, but then with the destruction of MC A3P users will be even more boned than us Spartan users (at least Suunto appears to promise POIs in the app before MC is finally given the death sentence). Not everyone wants flash stuff for showing off down the gym or at a running race, some of us want the basics as back up for mountain environments.
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@chrish POIs can be added directly on the watch. They are not managed on the app yet but hopefully will be. Waypoints are fully functional.
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@Brad_Olwin You can manually enter coordinates in advance, or you can record where you’re standing?
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@Ennoch said in Closing of Movescount is delayed further to 2021:
@Brad_Olwin said in Closing of Movescount is delayed further to 2021:
Not everyone wants flash stuff for showing off down the gym or at a running race, some of us want the basics as back up for mountain environments.
As I stated previously I do a lot of off trail mountaineering up to low class 5 but mostly class 4 on my trail runs. I also do a lot of SkiMo in the winter on peaks up to 4400m. These are off trail routes not in a gym and at least for me qualify as mountain environments. The Suunto 9 baro serves me better than my A3P for these.
I won’t go on further but will reiterate that we all have different opinions. I happen to be happy with what I have. Are there improvements I want? Sure, but my watch is fully functional as is. -
@Ennoch record where I am standing but I can use waypoints on a route to record ahead of time or use SuuntoPlus bearing for a line of sight direction or for a bearing on a map.
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Okay, so exactly the same path we’ve trodden before in previous threads, and your simplistic response doesn’t help - recording POI’s where I’m standing is useful and expected, as well as possible on my Spartan, but absolutely useless for navigation. I don’t want to know where I’m standing, I should know that, I want to know where I need to be!!). Planning a route in advance is fine, and I use it a lot. Having waypoints in that (per the app) is a useful addition but that implies you know in advance what you’re doing with regards an itinerary.
What’s missing here, and what we keep banging our bloody drums about is that POI’s are able to be created in advance and sent to the watch. You clearly never navigate this way, but very frequently I’ll have a known place I want to end up at (gully top on a featureless plateau, avalanche box, bothy, hut or water source etc) but not know in advance which direction I’ll be approaching that from. Therefore they’re logged in my watch relevant to the area I’ll be in and then used as/if necessary for navigation. See? I don’t always want a pre-populated route, most of the time I navigate with a map and compass, or just wander/ride and then want to get back to a known spot. Pre recorded POIS are thus a critical part of how I use my watch. Remove them and the watch becomes redundant. Clearly I’m not the only person to use the watch in this way given the number of people on here who also want POI’s to be implemented in the app.
Another useful thing to have in the Spartan would be the possibility to enter coordinates manually on the fly via the watch, but that ship has clearly long passed given the Spartan has long since ceased to see development.
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@Brad_Olwin you can’t enter a POI, you just record one. Useful to back track. Useless to go to a new place ‘in the field’. I can enter lat/long on my Ambit, or a Traverse. You can’t do that on a Spartan (which is why I dumped it) and you can’t do that on the S-series. Maybe an S7 cuz it’s Android, dunno, but definitely not on the S9.
