Ambit2 - spell it out for me...


  • Platinum Member

    @petmic
    I would wish an Ambit4 Peak Sapphire for my next birthday 🙂

    Totally agree and support your comment!



  • We do have a separate insight team having NPS surveys and what not to collect user needs and feedback. This forum is just one source and planned originally to be used for the application beta phase. We decided to not kill this when the closed beta ended and I think this forum is still on it’s way to be nice tool for us and our users.

    In my eyes one issue we see here is that we are quite slow on showing any changes that comes from the feedback we get. having the feedback to show in the end product is not as easy as one may think. I come from technical background like coding and Test Automation CI etc and it has been quite big eye opener to work with the marketing and other stakeholders to see how little I understand about those areas and reasoning behind product decisions…

    What comes to market shares, my understanding is that Suunto has never been big, even it has been in top3 with Garmin and Polar. Ambit was our hit product and one could say it was first of a kind. I still adore my Ambit3 in races and my runs but S9 has replaced it as daily watch and casual activity tracker. But atm is lacks some Outdoor features I’d like to have in my hikes, mainly POI related stuff. And I come from Finland where the Suunto brand knowledge is the best in the world.

    I share the worry about Ambit/Traverse users destiny and can assure they are not forgotten and I am personally fighting to get full support in Suunto app since Movescount is not improved anymore. This is not only because I’ve started my Suunto career with Ambit2 testing about 7 years ago. It’s because I believe it deserves and needs the supports as the devices are still great for years to come,


  • Bronze Member

    @Jouko-from-Suunto

    You said it all !!!

    Thanks

    👏 👏 👏


  • Moderator

    @Jouko-from-Suunto Thanks for your post here Jouko!

    I also think this forum here is a great place and tool for Suunto and us users.

    And I hope it will stay, to provide help for any new and existing user. I think we are on a very good way here with the development of this forum, many new users and proud owners of Suunto watches can find help here very easily and everyone can share valuable knowledge here.


  • Moderator



  • @Jouko-from-Suunto thanks for the details.
    I too love my Ambit 3, i actually prefer to race with the Ambit rather than my Spartan, its the simplicity that makes it great.
    I would love to migrate to the 9 but sadly this whole situation with the lack of web interface has done for that at the moment, how i can create / manage various routes on a tiny mobile phone is well… beyond me.
    I have played about with other websites but the effort / time required to sort this is just far too great for me, the simplicity of setting a route / POI in MC then just appearing in the watch was a very BIG+ now sadly I feel Suunto’s time is passing us by… unless something happens pretty soon…

    NO Ambit support / NO web interface = NO way forward.



  • @paul870 said in Ambit2 - spell it out for me...:

    @Jouko-from-Suunto thanks for the details.
    I too love my Ambit 3, i actually prefer to race with the Ambit rather than my Spartan, its the simplicity that makes it great.
    I would love to migrate to the 9 but sadly this whole situation with the lack of web interface has done for that at the moment, how i can create / manage various routes on a tiny mobile phone is well… beyond me.
    I have played about with other websites but the effort / time required to sort this is just far too great for me, the simplicity of setting a route / POI in MC then just appearing in the watch was a very BIG+ now sadly I feel Suunto’s time is passing us by… unless something happens pretty soon…

    NO Ambit support / NO web interface = NO way forward.

    Pretty much my thoughs too… Such a shame a great device will be ruined by the very company that brought them to being…


  • Moderator

    @lohtse I don’t own an Ambit, I made the jump from owning a T6D combined with a GPS Trail Pod for years to the Suunto Spartan Sport. But I totally understand what you are saying here and your frustration. I really Suunto will address that in the May update.


  • Bronze Member

    @

    What is the May update?
    It’s Suunto app update or watch fw update?


  • Moderator

    @Mi_chael Suunto is talking about some updates happening in Mai, see here:

    https://forum.suunto.com/topic/2382/april-transition-update

    Guess you have already seen it. 🙂 No further news since that one.


  • Bronze Member

    Guess this is the news for ambit 2 users… A discount code on the S9:
    Screenshot_2019-10-28-15-23-35-107_com.google.android.gm.png


  • Platinum Member

    @André-Faria
    how much?
    My wife owns an a3r but she doesn’t like the chest strap.
    The values she looks at for her half marathon/marathon trainings are pace, time, distance and hr…
    I’m thinking about giving her a Suunto 5 as I am veeery happy with my Suunto 9 Baro.
    …yes… SA is not yet where I want it and I miss a big screen version… but I don’t regret the step forward (knowing improvements to come) 👌


  • Bronze Member

    @TELE-HO Suunto 9 @299eur and suunto 9 baro @419eur.
    Guess it is the same price or near other European stores.


  • Platinum Member

    @André-Faria
    more or less, yes.
    I’ve heard sometimes that electronics in Switzerland are cheaper than in EU

    Screenshot_20191028_174534_com.ecosia.android.jpg


  • Bronze Member

    @TELE-HO said in Ambit2 - spell it out for me...:

    @André-Faria
    more or less, yes.
    I’ve heard sometimes that electronics in Switzerland are cheaper than in EU

    Screenshot_20191028_174534_com.ecosia.android.jpg

    I checked again in the stores in Portugal and they are expensive than this.
    If anyone needs the codes let me know by PM, I won’t use it.


  • Platinum Member

    @André-Faria
    my portuguese is not very good… actually stops after bom dia and obrigado…
    but my understanding is that suunto offers to ambit and ambit2 users a discount to upgrade older watches before they shut down MC.
    hence my recent thinking that MC will stay alive seems to be outdated… the good assumption out of this is that ambit3 is more likely to be better integrated into SA.


  • Bronze Member

    @TELE-HO said in Ambit2 - spell it out for me...:

    @André-Faria
    my portuguese is not very good… actually stops after bom dia and obrigado…
    but my understanding is that suunto offers to ambit and ambit2 users a discount to upgrade older watches before they shut down MC.
    hence my recent thinking that MC will stay alive seems to be outdated… the good assumption out of this is that ambit3 is more likely to be better integrated into SA.

    Well, when I traded my Ambit 2 Sapphire for an Ambit 3 Sapphire that was my thinking.
    In my head. Having an app only, and making it work with cable operated devices for everyone would be very very dificult.
    Suunto never did it with movescount mobile, never had an offline software for pc for the ambit line, so I think they would just ditch this watches, offer a good discount and that’s it.
    Although me and others don’t like it, it is better than nothing.
    That was why I trated my Ambit 2 Sapphire for an Ambit 3 Sapphire, a very low cost move (About 40eur I guess) and for something that works everytime and covers all my needs.


  • Platinum Member

    @André-Faria
    I also bought (a new) A3PS only in June and will keep it.
    I also upgraded to a nice S9B out of interest 😉


  • Bronze Member

    @TELE-HO what is your user experience with the two watches?


  • Platinum Member

    @KnutB
    you risk a long essay about pros and cons 😉
    but I try to make it short and highlight what’s important to me.
    In general, they are two different watches and while A3PS is a stable, reliable and tough watch, there are some things that need some love from Suunto team in the S9B. The S9B works reliable for me, don’t get me wrong:

    here’s what I see…
    phone/pc software:
    A3PS in combination with MC is convenient to use at the desktop, MC app is basically only good for spontaneous setup and else only to sync without a cable.
    On the other hand S9B, I would be quite disappointed to use it only in combo with my phone. I appreciate all functionality of SA without the desktop. I will mainly use it with the phone but want to have the opportunity to look at activities on a big screen. But there are still some (not a lot) things missing for me in SA like ascent summaries, crop and merge of activities and analyzing the parameters by selecting zones on x axis e. g. to analyze one specific ascent. (I hope this will come!)

    gps accuracy:
    it is not veeery important to me even I appreciate better accuracy when it’s there. A3PS is a bit better (where I have tested it). I did not test indeepth galileo or glonass effects. The fact that S9B is galileo and glonass ready is a big plus and I request to use the 3 systems individually without gps!
    In the S9 pros and cons thread I posted the result of a direct comparison of the watches recordings and noticed that S9B has a more nervouse recording. Might be better for faster activities. On slower activities it could be a disadvantage.

    display:
    I was a bit afraid of a color display, but it is very good to read on the S9B in a lot of angles, while the A3PS is slightley worse to read but good over a wider range of angles. In lowlight it’s still good to see.

    baro/ascent calculation:
    with my main activities the ascent calculation is pretty precise. during my comparison test on rollinglish terrain I noticed that S9B calculates less ascent meters than A3PS. Question here is: which one is right? Gut feeling: A3PS. But S9B might improve with a new FW update. And with my normal activities (one or two bigger climbs) this has a small effect.

    heartrate:
    I like the OHR alot even I did not think that I would ever use it. I mainly use the chest strap for better accuracy and less battery consumption. But for some activities I don’t want to wear the chest strap, eg hiking, and I live on the compromise that (for me and my watch wearing style) the results are not always perfect.
    A3PS is missing this feature of course.
    What I like even more is the zones ring on the outer ring of the screen with the indicator in every parameter screen that shows me in which of my HR zones I am at the moment. So I can see that even when I am in the ascent values screen…

    screens/parameters:
    up to 7 in S9B and 3 in A3PS… it reduces the pressing and fiddling on the watch during the activity.

    apps:
    I thought I would miss ambit apps… until now, I don’t miss them to be honest.
    My most important app was to change m/min ascent rate into m/h. But this can be selected by default in S9B

    battery:
    I bought the A3PS because of very good battery life. S9B is even better.

    wrist strap:
    A3PS gives me the impression with the screwed fixation it is indestructible. S9B with the quick release gives a less robust feeling… who knows, it’s just a feeling 😉

    In general I have a very good impression of S9B even there is room for improvement on small details for handling and some slightly bigger room for improvement on the gps accuracy and total ascent calculation for rolling terrain.
    I see more things that need to be solved on SA side. For me and for the moment it’s fine as some of the missing things can be done with Strava and Elevate extend… of course having everything out of one hand is much appreciated!

    sorry, it became a bit longer but I did not cover all topics… if you have any questions, just let me know. If you give me some time I can even test something between A3PS and S9B.

    IMG_20191028_222029.jpg

    edit:
    route planning and sync to the watch is very easy with the SA and S9B… who knows, in case A3PS will be completely supported with SA it will be a big step forward. You can go on a short weekend trip, without laptop, lookup some trails, do a quick planning on the phone, sync to the watch and start biking or running 👍


  • Bronze Member

    @Brad_Olwin perhaps a written commitment to support the Ambit 2 line would go some way to endear Suunto’s customer base. There needs to be a long term plan to support legacy devices, the software development doesn’t fund itself.

    Instead, they have thrown loyal legacy users under the bus with this, possibly to see the scale of the reaction before deciding whether they will bother with investment. Perhaps Suunto are hopeful third party apps will be developed which again will take Suunto off the financial hook in supporting the Ambit 2 and older models.

    If this is the case, Suunto should do the decent thing and open source the interface logic in order for the continued fully functional use of the ambit 2, T6C and such devices.

    Instead, Suunto naively expect their “loyal” customer base to upgrade with a corresponding pickup in sales. My other bet is, Suunto have designed obsolescence in their more modern devices, most probably through the battery life. This means that once bought into the ecosystem, you are committed to buy repeatedly. This of course does note affect the older devices which only required a recharge so often and actually could have their batteries changed without melting glue to deconstruct the device. I have replaced the battery on my 2R and the T6C battery was a user replaceable CR3032. Doesn’t lend itself to throwaway product life cycles does it.

    Suunto should be ashamed. They have gone from a serious product supplier to one whose customer support is now seemingly controlled by marketing and bean counters in head office.

    Hence the reason I will be returning my A3 Peak and slating Suunto to every club and military user of Suunto I can meet. Dont under estimate the power of your loyal user base to go viral on this and create real problems for Suunto.


  • Platinum Member

    @mbga9pgf said in Ambit2 - spell it out for me...:

    perhaps a written commitment to support the Ambit 2 line would go some way to endear Suunto’s customer base.

    you seem to search the forum and support page not good enough


  • Bronze Member

    Ive read it fine thanks… and seen there are suggestions of fobbing off support to external providers, with reduced functionality (unless you pay a subscription). Not sure how this is meeting the requirements of Suunto’s customer base, or engendering future loyalty to the brand.



  • Hi there,

    this topic got quite lengthy so I may not have read every single comment, but I think I have got the main message. I’ve also read the e-mails Suunto sends out regarding the transition.

    Now, I’ve been using an Ambit 2 since 2013 or so and got myself a Spartan (the model with Ambit-like GPS antenna and wrist HR) more recently. I’ve always synchronized using the cable that clamps the watch. Never used the app and I don’t own a compatible device for doing so. Of course with the used market littered with obsolete electronics it isn’t too hard to get hold of a compatible device to just perform the data transfer but to be honest, compared to a computer screen of at least 12" running Movescount, mapping a route on a 5" cellphone seems fiddly.

    Either way, going down that route it still appears like the data gathered with the Ambit 2 won’t be integrated with the data gathered with the Spartan. At least from the Suunto e-mails I understand that Ambit 2 data will be viewable on a web service (an evolution of the current Movescount) but it is said that this won’t be compatible with my Spartan (which will require an app for everything). Is this true or will both sets of training data always be integrated (as if I’m actually one single person who just happens to use two Suunto watches)?

    I admit owning and actively using two advanced watches (and not using an advanced phone to go with it) seems odd. But there is just stuff in both watches I like. Sure the Spartan is more sophisticated. Navigation is really nice, I like the way multisport works and for my commutes (which I’m tracking too as I’m usually hauling) it is nice to not have to wear a strap or a third party optical wrist sensor (like Mio Link or similar). But I’m not ready to let go of the Ambit 2 as I can program more advanced trainings like pyramid intervals etc. The Spartan only does intervals with equal length. As an alternative, is there a Suunto watch out that does everything the Ambit 2 does yet is compatible with the app (other than the Ambit 3)?

    Not sure whether this is the place to do feature requests, but ideally I’d call for keeping the web service compatible with all current watches. I currently synchronize the Spartan with a cable, would love to just keep doing so and see all my training data in that one spot.

    So yeah: TL;DR:

    • Will the new web service also show my Spartan training data and will the app also show the Ambit training data so that I can see all my training data in one place?

    • Is there a Suunto watch other than Ambit 3 that is compatible with the app service and still does everything the Ambit 2 does?

    • I’d love to see synchronization over the cable compatible with newer watches too. In my case, the Spartan in particular. After all, this was one of the reasons I got this one. That I could use that single cable with both watches. Would be sad to see that thrown overboard.

    Thank you for clearing things up!
    Vinay


  • Platinum Member

    @vinay
    the announcements leave quite some room for interpretation…
    I understand that it is going into the direction that you are favouring: sync both watches to SA thru cable with Suuntolink and setup in the evolved MC

    I think many users would buy this watch that you are asking for right away… there is no hybrid of ambit and spartan/s-line at the moment


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