Several navigation issues (feedback)

dreamer_

This is the usual route for these testings (re-uploaded with better quality)

The track is roundtrip: Up (with 2 additional forks) to the top of a mountain, and down repeating everything again

Notifications mostly work in both directions. It’s just about the accuracy of them, remaining the notifications inside and after the turns (refer to my previous post with the shots of the very first roundabout)

About the microphone/speaker, I was only speaking about the audio navigation notifications since this thread is about navigation thinking in the use of the headphones (I.E, the Garmin Instinct 3 does not have a microphone or speaker but has audio notifications through the headphones (and that watch is able to even notify the roundabouts and despite It can’t show the maps). Suunto has already invested in the engineering of very nice headphones and with very interesting products that are already in the market (like the Spark). I think that with several software updates (both watch and headphones), those kind of products could be used as a very nice marketing thing (for something like an “ecosystem”). I’m thinking also in running indoor or treadmill when there’s no GNSS signal.
But this is another topic, just to explain It further (and also to say that you already have the microphone and speaker in the market that could be used to go further). In my opinion, optional audio navigation notifications are sometimes incredible useful.

Thank you so much

dreamer_

@joaquin there’s definetely a bug here, and I found the explanation.

I made another experiment. If inside Komoot I don’t check the roundtrip, it does not make any effect , since the route is roundtrip (or at least, I can see indications in both directions despite of that)

But it is more. It’s Komoot what is making the bad turn-by-turn directions. Have a look at this photo:

A: Start point
B: End point of the route

What you see in the photos I posted in the other post is that Suunto is notifiying that 1 as the very first point, because of Komoot’s issue. That’s why there’s the 18 meters offset in the photos I posted for you.

So offset explained.

Now, about the photos you uploaded.
Photos 2,4,3,5. Suunto’s notifications seem to be wrong and that is a one-way track (no roundtrip).

What I’m seeing (3 and 5) is that there are several turns close together. It’s like there is something bad at the algorythms, detecting 2 very close left turns as an U-turn. Perhaps this is Komoot related.
What happens when turns are very close inside Komoot?

In my opinion, it’s very clear Komoot’s workaround is more a problem, once we know others are not having these kind of issues.

dreamer_

Today, I repeated the whole track.
A shot inside a turn:

Another one:

The offset issue is there all time. Worst thing seems this is caused by Komoot, not Suunto. And basically Komoot’s algorythms are not as strong as other’s (which is bad for Suunto).

And, I also got:

2 false out of the route. One was at the top of the last hill/mountain. Notifying a 30m offset.
False incoming climbs notifying a down when I was going up and also an up notification when I was going down. The first one was near the end of the last climb.

As explained before, I have the feeling that autoreverse needs some serious work too because of the lost turns.

runyx17

Just a note:
If I create a route in the Suunto app or the Suunto Route Planner, the turns are announced correctly, about 20 meters before the turn. If I create a route in Mapy .com, the turns are announced with a delay, usually exactly at the point of the turn. I dont have Komoot.

dreamer_

Explanation of one of the “Out of the route” . It seems an issue generated by Komoot:

Track inside Komoot:

Track inside Garmin Connect:

I have never finished that route where Komoot is saying, I allways finish at the top (as you can see in Garmin Connect’s track).

It does also explain the last bad climb guidance notification. The watch triggered a downhill pop-up, but I was going up (the track was not finished yet).
It means the Komoot workaround does not only affect to the turn-by-turn notifications, but ALSO to Climb Guidance.

Needless to say that, despite I had tested this track in Coros and Amazfit, I have re-uploaded the same track to Coros and Amazfit to be sure. This issue is only in Kommot.

Coros:

Amazfit:

Another thing:

The shot with the track I uploaded yesterday here:

https://forum.suunto.com/topic/15071/several-navigation-issues-feedback/39

In the first fork (of those 2), I noticed I have reversed Climb Guidance notifications (uphill when it should be downhill and downhill when it should be uphill). Those 2 small forks, are basically 2 slopes with a final U-turn. I understand it is very likely this issue is (again) caused by Komoot, since it’s Komoot who is creating all the logic that Suunto uses for the turn-by-turn directions and Climb Guidance.

What I don’t understand how is it possible I’m finding these kind of issues.

If Komoot is not accurate, will Suunto have the Komoot approach forever?

dreamer_

@runyx17 said in Several navigation issues (feedback):

Just a note:
If I create a route in the Suunto app or the Suunto Route Planner, the turns are announced correctly, about 20 meters before the turn. If I create a route in Mapy .com, the turns are announced with a delay, usually exactly at the point of the turn. I dont have Komoot.

Guys. This is important. So Mapy seems to have the same issue as Komoot.

And, one VERY interesting thing:

If I upload my track in Suunto Route Planner, the end is also ok. Look:

But in Suunto Route Planner, can I upload a GPX (provided by a race organization) and have turn-by-turn directions?

Because it seems we can have a fix here for several issues related to TBT and even Climb Guidance. And it’s also very likely that autoreverse can be (just a bit) more reactive once the offset is solved.

dreamer_

Route Planner does not have the turn-by-turn.
I tried saving that route in Route Planner and then uploaded into Komoot, and the same issues persist in Komoot.

dreamer_

I created a support case in Komoot with the GPX and a photo that shows the offset. I should not (this is not my job) but it’s also I can do with my track. I’ll keep this thread updated with their info (if there’s any). I also sent comments in the Suunto App.
I made some manual fixes but I’m not sure that an edit of the passing points will make any effect. I also fixed the end at that mountain in Komoot but this is not good at all . I should not edit anything downloaded (in this case I know the track, but that will not happen in a track of a place I have never been).
So I’ll test this edited track. I understand I have (at least) fixed the end at the top of the mountain (and the out of the route and the bad climb guidance notifications will not be triggered in that point), but the rest is really a mistery.
Perhaps Route Planner is the solution. If you can make the imported GPX tracks have turn-by-turn, that’d be really fantastic.

dreamer_

Today I did another test with a different round-trip track.

Editing those points of the track in Komoot does not seem to make any effect. The offset is always there.
After a while, I went out of the route like 1km and then I returned to the route again and started running back in the route. The autoreverse did not work until a very long time. I started receiving notifications but after skipping many indications.

Another little thing:

The text when out of the route is extremely small and completely unreadable.

This needs a little fix (that icon is just an invented one as an example, and colors and everything should be according to the layout)

dreamer_

After 10 days, I have the answer provided by Komoot

Hello there,
 
Thanks for your message.
 
What you’re seeing is related to how komoot processes imported GPX files, and I’m happy to explain what’s happening and what you can try.
 
When you import a GPX file as a planned route, komoot doesn’t display the track exactly as it is. Instead, it processes it through its routing system. During this step, you’re usually given two options:
 
Stick to original route: keeps the track as it is, though some sections may appear as straight (off-grid) lines if they don’t match known paths. Navigation can be less precise in those parts. Match route to known ways: adjusts the route to follow mapped paths, which can slightly change the original track but often improves navigation guidance.
 
For round trips where the route overlaps itself (for example, going out and back along the same path), this processing can sometimes lead to unexpected results. You might see gaps, shifted endpoints, or the route not finishing exactly where it should. This can also lead to “off route” notifications on your watch.
 
Regarding turn-by-turn instructions, komoot provides guidance slightly before the actual turn to allow time to react. On connected devices like Suunto watches, this can feel more noticeable due to how the data is transferred, so a small offset is expected. Larger differences are often linked to how the route was interpreted during import.
 
Here are a few things you can try:
Re-import the GPX file on the komoot website and choose Stick to original route, then review the route carefully before saving
If the route is quite long and you’re using Premium, try importing it as a multi-day Tour with the same option
After saving, open the route in the planner and check that the endpoint and path look correct before syncing it to your device
 
If the route still doesn’t appear correctly after this, it falls into a known area where GPX imports can behave differently than expected. At the moment, there isn’t a way to fully prevent komoot from processing the file through its routing system.
 
If you have any other questions or need assistance in the future, don’t hesitate to reach out. We’re here to help!
 
Have a great day!
komoot Support Team

They basically confirm:

GAPs and missing parts
Delays with turn-by-turn indications

So those both navigation issues Suunto watches have, are basically caused by Komoot, as I was pretty sure. I’ll continue with the support with things like several turns in quick succession (and considering the delays), but this is a dead end.