Important news concerning our digital services



  • Removal of web based services and moving towards purely App based services whilst pointing users to third party software is quite simply a step backwards.

    I’m no tech geek but Movescount is a cracking tool for reviewing your data and a suitable tool for route planning/review. Regardless of the power/functions of the new app it will be limited by its screen size at the very least.

    Garmin did something similar with the 310xt (gpx traces became a nightmare to upload) and that prompted me to buy the Suunto Ambit 3 peak based on my partners positive experiences with her Ambit 2 (which will now become a paperweight???).

    Maybe it is time for me to move on again as I am not a happy bunny with this decision.



  • @ianshowalter thanks for feedback, got it!


  • Bronze Member

    @rsmacleod Strava is Social Media. Over and out.



    1. Maps need large screens, small screens are not useful and create fatigue, not matter how good the app is. Loosing the web would be a disaster

    2. I could understand a reasonable Suunto web subscription, like starting at 15€/year. The service it’s just as relevant as the watch, they are not separate things.



  • there might be different views, if MC is a perfect tool, but definetily there needs to be a web based tool in ADDITION to any app. viewing my tracks on a smart phone is a nice gimmick, planning moves, viewing maps, i prefer to do on my 24" screen.
    I sincerely hope an pray, that Suunto is listening to their customers, to snub your customers is never a good choice… (eg Nokia) especially as i cannot imagine anyone who is getting a benefit by switching off the web base service (beside some potential cost savings on Suunto’s side), but this “gain” will become a trojan horse, once customers are moving off…


  • Bronze Member

    Suunto, how about an offline standalone windows movescount programme? I don’t know how technically difficult that would be, but it would enable most of us with older devices to do most of the things we need. Examples:-Every time I run under power lines in a snowstorm I get a spiked HR reading - this throws out the TE value for all subsequent sessions until I reset the max HR via movescount. If I want to customise the screens for a particular event or sport I can only do it via movescount. Likewise for entering waypoints, reviewing routes etc. I’d be happy to store my data on my own laptop and the only thing I would really miss would be the satellite updates - but how important are these anyway?- I never update my car GPS. I don’t think we need it to be online, so if you could produce such a programme (and maybe most of it already exists in the current movescount) I think you would go a long way towards mitigating the problem and satisfying owners of older devices.



  • in case, please dont limit to windows - there are also mac users out there…


  • Bronze Member

    @martin-groschner
    And Linux



  • Could be implemented using the Electron Framework. Running on Windows, Mac and Linux.




  • Moderator

    @Emir-Karisik said in Important news concerning our digital services:

    https://www.dcrainmaker.com/2019/01/suunto-announces-decommission-plans-for-movescount-platform-impacting-some-watches.html

    Maybe someone should tell him that “Sport tracker is not the official SA web platform” … not yet at least.



  • @mbergi said in Important news concerning our digital services:

    @rsmacleod Strava is Social Media. Over and out.

    So true… and additionally, as @Brad_Olwin stated it is a “braggard board”… and I simply love that as a quote 😁


  • Bronze Member

    @Emir-Karisik said in Important news concerning our digital services:

    Some thoughts about this from famous sport equipment reviewer DC Rainmaker:
    https://www.dcrainmaker.com/2019/01/suunto-announces-decommission-plans-for-movescount-platform-impacting-some-watches.html

    I think this passage is especially cute:

    they’re awaiting user feedback and then will determine a specific course of action from there. Which is a simple way of saying they’re waiting to see how many people scream (and how loud they scream).

    No, my friend, no! Of course they are not “waiting to see how many people scream”. They know exactly how many people will scream, they have full MovesCount usage statistics for the older devices. It’s just these people would be the minority by the time of shutdown.

    Don’t you think it was really obvious from the start that the decision to simply brick one of their most popular watch series of the past decade was not going to fly with just about anyone, starting with the current owners? Of course the damage has already been done, simply by the very fact of making such an announcement, and it wouldn’t be undone even if that decision could be reversed (which won’t really happen). This was actually expected.

    What they might be really considering is their sales stats for Suunto 3 and Suunto 9 watches in the coming months. These are the first Suunto watch series with no official support for MovesCount - so if these still sell, everything is fine. Voting with your money is the only vote that counts.

    All in all, the current markets are becoming oversaturated, so it’s time to move over to greener pastures. And if that fails, they can always dumb the platform down (i.e “make it simple and user-friendly”) to further cut on production and support costs.

    As for the owners of current BLE watches, believe me, they will be eventually convinced to move over to the Suunto App. They just have no other choice if they want to continue using their watches.

    Again, please understand that it was not a spontaneous decision taken without any consideration, and that it won’t be reverted, no matter the amount of possible backlash from the users. All that voting and petitioning is just for letting out the steam.

    I’m optimistic Suunto will come up with a plan to solve things over the next few months. By going with a decommissioning date some 18 months into the future, they’ve given themselves plenty of time to come up with a plan and execute on it. Even if we don’t necessarily like it. Hopefully, that end plan will at least maintain core functionality for all watch owners, even if it lacks the extended functionality.

    Wishful thinking at best. Do not expect some miracle to happen - 18 months from now would be barely enough to properly implement the announced transfer options and make the Suunto App usable.

    Please only consider the features that have been outlined in the official announcement. These are the only ones that will be actually implemented, if all goes well. Do not rely on possible great new features that could be added in the future if they were not confirmed.

    These are the simple rules of surviving product planning and release management from big multinational corporations.



  • @DmitryKo agree, couldn’t have write it better, like the bit of sarcasm in your line:

    “Wasn’t it really obvious from the start that the decision to simply brick one of their most popular watch series of the past decade was not going to fly with just about anyone, starting with the current owners?”



  • @Tobias-F

    For Ambit 1 & Ambit 2 series
    "
    I went round and round with Suunto on this via e-mail, and the long and the short of it is that they’re awaiting user feedback and then will determine a specific course of action from there. Which is a simple way of saying they’re waiting to see how many people scream (and how loud they scream).
    "

    From: dcrainmaker

    It is also obvious from which company Suunto copied their new digital strategy.
    Xiaomi (of amazfit fame) also has no web interface. A manufacturer of a sports watch that costs 130 euros that is based in China that has been referenced by moderators here as the model of things going forward.
    To be fair, I think Xiaomi does not have an open API.



  • About open API: problem with the api is that it’s not really open. You have to have company and real product. I was about to code some stuff, but can’t get access for ‘personal projects’…


  • Community Manager

    @jwiberg It is open but you have to do something with it. ITs not for you to pull data to excel, but if you make an IFTT, for example, recipe (something you share) then it’s open to individuals.



  • @Dimitrios-Kanellopoulos ok, thx for info 🙂



  • @Yannis-Belouris
    How about this one?
    https://www.gearbest.com/promotion/KOSPET-BRAVE-.html
    For $59.99!
    Are Suunto watches really worth 10 times more? This one right here you will be able to use until you break it, manufacturer will not kill it when they decide it’s too old. You could even buy 10 of these and just replace them when or if you break them.

    Suunto don’t play “we are poor, have no resources” etc. game on us! There are manufacturers who make sport watches that cost 10 times less and will not be killed by their manufacturers! They even have fully functional app and you are able to change the settings by yourself, inside the watch! You really want to make us buy someone else’s products instead of your premium price - soon to be paperweight (“perhaps”) watches in the future?

    I really love your products but please stop making fools of ourselves! You make huge profits selling high priced products that you marketed as “built to last” and now you want to persuade us that means 1.5-2 years? Come on! I bet the watch from this link up there can last 2 years too.

    The least you can do is to make an offline software for managing all available settings of our watches, with ability to export data from your watches and import for the routes and POI-s. And make it open source. That would mean you respect your loyal customers. That would mean you are proud there are people who use your products for long time and they work! That would really justify top prices you are charging for your watches and not make us compare you to loads of other crappy watches manufacturers out there.



  • @Emir-Karisik
    Time will tell if Suunto made the right call.
    We are voicing our concern. If this will be heard is another matter.
    Since abandoning my Fenix5, I have bought an Ambit3 vertical, 2 SSS, 1SSSWHR, 1S9 and 1 SSU.
    I chose Suunto because of the build quality and looks.
    Really bought into this European company mentality and tried to support the underdog.

    What Suunto is saying (now) is something that we are being reminded by the some people with good intentions here:

    Caveat emptor
    

  • Community Manager

    @Yannis-Belouris said in Important news concerning our digital services:

    We are voicing our concern. If this will be heard is another matter.

    Isn’t this what it’s all about?


  • Bronze Member

    Possibly the new apps will be great.
    But it has to match in every points what MC offered.
    Large screen is very important for mapping anything.
    Data analysis is extensive in MC on single records or records to records.
    Calendar view is very useful, and also planning.
    Configuring watches on large screen is much more convenient.

    Communication is catastrophic.
    Ambit 1 and 2 support is still required. Programmed obsolecense is so bad for a company reputation today. They even consider financial compensation for products that shall even 10-15 years life cycle (when you sell quality, you sell lasting products).
    Most users bought suunto with the MC support as advertized. Breaking up this support leaves a really bad feeling about the company. It opens up for class actions as well, as the company is not provided the services it has sold.
    From being X9 owner, Ambit 2 owner and now SSU, driven by the outdoor and trekking, mapping has been a big plus of Suunto solutions (software + MC). On a 4-5’ screen, suunto no longer targer outdoor guys.
    That’s stupid for a company that had its roots in compass for mapping in the outdoor.

    Moving to the Apps could be great, but the new system, whatever its name is, must cover what MC offered, heavily discussed on the web. And this includes webbase interface.



  • @Dimitrios-Kanellopoulos Exactly right.
    For us, it seems we are fighting an unprovoked, pointless and unnecessary war.
    I would must rather be fighting for FW features and/or how to integrate some of the analysis tools that are available online into the platform.


  • Community Manager

    @Yannis-Belouris why do you say that?



  • @Dimitrios-Kanellopoulos
    Regardless if I feel that a large portion of users do not care if there is a web interface or not, as long as they have strava sync, we can agree that this is a -planned- regression of functionality. We could be proven wrong.
    This will make the annual upgrade decision much more difficult than it should have.
    Between the unfinished Android app, the planned non-existence of a web interface, the ridiculous (sorry, but it is), situation with suunto HR belts, the minimal upgrade that S9 was in relation to SSU, the WHR issues (locked in cadence for the first x minutes, etc) things are not very rosy.
    And, and I mean this, it pains me that I seem to come across as ungrateful for all the hard hard work that the IT people are investing. I very much admire their hard work, and would buy any one of them a beer if I ever meet one.

    Working in a similar environment, I can relate to working hard towards a non ideal target.
    The difference between:
    Effectiveness - doing “the right” things
    Efficiency - doing things in the most economical way
    It is the business people that are steering things into uncharted territory. Maybe they have better vision than me.
    Long rant over. Let;'s keep our hopes up. Also, when is the new FW out ? --Just kidding.
    Efficacy - getting things done


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